Unleash the onslaught of defensive fans!

i went to the show in b’more. while it was much better live than the album, i can relate to the first comment. the music was amazing, but it was no dance party and there was definitely a surplus of phony hipsters standing still with arms crossed at the waistline or above the head in the ‘t’ pattern, which was pretty lame. the after-party kind of licked too. except the lounge had some talent. i.e. two plastered skimmies humping each other on the bar stools, legs spread-eagle, and one not afraid to turn the experience into a clothed titty bar by shelling out lap dances. you’d never see this at 9:30.

http://www.brightestyoungthings.com/music/guest-column-what-is-live-anymore/

has ANYONE read this article?! first read it, then lets discuss.

everyone is entitled to their opinion. yes, i can see how you can feel “scammed, ” perhaps you are used to more of a “rock” show. but to go on and say that americans are naive about dance music just shows how little you know about the current state of affairs of americans involved.

go ahead, now, do it. name me 3 american D.Js that can even come close to the caliber of these two guys. then name me a show that you have seen, put on my american djs that was better than this. I’m talking current. Here I’ll tell you one: DJ Logic (and he’s only so-so)

The entire 930 was transformed on wednesday night into a gloroius euro trashy disco. You cant get that sound or that sort of light show ANY where in the city, outside of waving some glowsticks at Five or Buzz… but even then thats more of the “rave” and less of a “disco.” yes, there is a difference. (have you gone to a Starscape Festival, at least?!) i can’t get that rib jolting feeling in my living room listening to the album, i cant get blown away by the killer 930 soundsystem, nor do I have that uberheady light show.

i will agree, there were alot of kids at the show, underage kids, bless their sober hearts. I felt they really had NO clue of the force that Ed Banger djs bring, nor of the incredible history of european dance music and its influencing on american dance and indie genres.

finally, you say you are a fan of daft punk. its laughable that you respect their live shows. what do you think people were saying after they say those? the exact same thing you are!

whatever. anytime anything gets “too popular” the hipsters immediately being to trash it.

who honestly expected this to be any different than what it was? if you’re going to go to this shit, you might as well accept that it’s not going to be some virtuoso djing and try to have fun while you’re there. i went up in the sea of freaking out 19 year olds and fucking danced to songs i liked while they were played very loudly. this was a good enough time for me.

“go ahead, now, do it. name me 3 american D.Js that can even come close to the caliber of these two guys. then name me a show that you have seen, put on my american djs that was better than this. I’m talking current. Here I’ll tell you one: DJ Logic (and he’s only so-so)

The entire 930 was transformed on wednesday night into a gloroius euro trashy disco. You cant get that sound or that sort of light show ANY where in the city, outside of waving some glowsticks at Five or Buzz… but even then thats more of the “rave” and less of a “disco.” yes, there is a difference. (have you gone to a Starscape Festival, at least?!) i can’t get that rib jolting feeling in my living room listening to the album, i cant get blown away by the killer 930 soundsystem, nor do I have that uberheady light show. ”

Seriously? Like, you’re serious about what you just said.

Preface: I like Justice. I thought the show was a show. It wasn’t a party. That’s a bummer. I’d rather go to a party than a show.

Aside from that.

1) American DJs that are better, at what? Production? DJing? Seriously, you must be drunk if you think these dudes are at the apex of either DJing or production. I respect their music. It’s good. Fuck the haters. But, it’s hardly ‘OMGOMGOMG BETTER THAN EVERYTHING’. As DJs, they’re mediocre to bad. They did a great set last night, because they preprogrammed the whole thing in Ableton. No hate-o; do you. But, that’s not DJing. They played all their own songs and ended in an hour. A real DJ set lasts for hours+, and encompasses more than your own discography. I have seen them actually DJ, and they’re really not great at it. Even their mixes, like the much-heralded Rejected Fabric mix , are weak. That mix, despite what fooled hipsters think, is populated by kitschy, weak tracks and boring/lackluster mixing.

2) “transformed into a glorious euro trashy disco” What the fuck are you talking about? Have you been to a real party outside of watching them on youtube? 9:30 was it’s usual, sweaty, fratty self on Wednesday night, aside from some glowsticks and a bunch of lights.

“You can’t get that sort of light show anywhere in the city, outside of some waving glowsticks at Five or Buzz.”

Maybe you should actually go to Five, which i’m not that fond of, or Fur, which I am, before you make totally ludicrous and baseless statements. Fur has a fucking great lightshow. They also have a fantastic soundsystem. They also bring real DJs (though it’s quite often far too old beat ass rave DJs, and not regularly enough stuff like Laidback Luke, James Zabiela, MSTRKRFT, or Deadmau5–all of which have been through DC at Fur within the past six months).

Five also has one of the best soundsystems in the city. You know what doesn’t? 9:30. It’s alright for shows. It wasn’t that great for Justice.

In closing, don’t let this response be misconstrued. I like most of the Ed Banger productions. Feadz, Justice, Busy P, DJ Medhi, and Sebastian have all pressed some great stuff. But, Feadz, DJ Medhi and Busy P are the only ones who can DJ. And 99% of the label is HYPE.

This ain’t about being popular and becoming unhip. It’s about approaching shit with a level, hypebeast-free head.

“I find it obnoxious that their brand of dance music needs to be packaged and presented into a consumable product that is acceptable for underage kids and their chaperon parents to lap up.”

Well, that’s Justice. If you don’t like that from the outset, why are you reviewing it?

Ben - true, but the Fischerspooner show here just sucked. They brought none of the stage props they have in NY - they just brought some strobes. Hell they fucked up a few songs, missed intros on others, started over, didn’t bother lip-synching to some, then at the end said they’d play an encore but they didn’t have any more songs so if the audience wouldn’t mind they’d just play a couple others over again. Actually that last bit was pretty cheeky and got a chuckle out of me, but the performance itself seemed like they were being forced to do it. It completely sucked.

But, unlike a regular old DJ, they do attempt to put on a show (at least in NY). Going to a venue to stand and watch some guys push buttons without the benefit of any showmanship? God, what fucking suckers people are.

The F’spooner show was completely unlike the Hurricane Isabel BRMC show when about 25 people showed up and BRMC still put on the same performance with the same intensity that they have during sold-out shows.

I just find the whole resurgence of the electronic music thing amusing since I’ve pretty much been involved in it since it started coming about. I find it really funny that most of the people who are into Justice and other electronic bands wouldn’t bother stepping foot at a place like Nation (RIP) where you can hear real electronic music and people actually dance. Guess the black attire scares them.

“go ahead, now, do it. name me 3 american D.Js that can even come close to the caliber of these two guys. then name me a show that you have seen, put on my american djs that was better than this. I’m talking current. Here I’ll tell you one: DJ Logic (and he’s only so-so)”

In terms of performance, Timmy Regisford at the Shelter on ANY GIVEN WEEKEND or Karizma anywhere he can play on 3 CDJs BLOW THESE DUDES AWAY with mindblowing displays of music programming, mixing, live manipulation and on the fly editing.

My whole point of this article was that we are NOT naive about dance music, unlike how Justice’s publicist told me that in America that dance music had to be packaged this way otherwise we wouldn’t “get it”.

Daft Punk now is just a big of a farce as Justice. But that wasnt the case 10 or more years ago. I have been partying and going to shit since I was 17, from Drum N Bass to Trance and now to the more legitimate confines of Disco and Deep House. Magic such as a dirty sweaty warehouse has been created several times over in the past few months, you just were too caught up not to come fucking party.

NP - Actually I logged on betting it would be positive. I was invited to go review it but I knew I’d hate it and have a miserable time and my review would reflect as much and I didn’t feel like defending another review of mine all day long because, in fact, I much prefer to think about strippers, believe it or not.

I was surprised it was negative, and I’m glad it was. People think I’m a dick - no, I just don’t suffer mediocrity well. Hell, I can barely tolerate it. I wish things didn’t suck. I wish people demanded better, but they don’t - we’re a nation of package consumers. Pretty package? Eat it up. Then defend it because you ate it even if you know deep down that it wasn’t any good. In fact take it a step further and become offended on behalf of the package.

This goes to my point above re: Nation (and the other electronic music events in the city): most people don’t like the packaging (i.e., kids in black, eyeliner, “weird” clothes) so they don’t bother going, even though they’d hear really fucking good electronic music. Instead they clambor to go to shows like Justice and GirlTalk and think they’re seeing and hearing something special.

They aren’t.

what this thread needs is a really boring comment from some dude who’s mad because Justice is popular and the bullshit he likes is not. oh wait, we’re all stocked up on those.

anyone that really wants to see what a great dj is capable of doing should go to Eighteenth Street Lounge on any given Sunday night for Sam Burns’ Underground Soul Solution.

(no i’m not a promoter for this event)

Sven Vath

You know what will be here in a few years?

Strippers.

The thing about Justice is that they’re good producers, and there’s no reason to say right now that their music will have no longevity. Justice is not the same thing as all the fucking dickriders who imitate their style, just like whatever goth shit you’re talking about is not the same as its third-rate derivatives.

oh man, I really don’t care, you know what I was referring to. the shit at Nation.

Front 242, Coil, Cabaret Voltaire ….jeesh, you are so eyeliner today.

Patrick,

I am in eigth grade, but am doing well.

Hey, I have a book report on venereal diseases due on Monday, any tips?

And of course, I managed to screw up the above.

I think the thing that bothers people about Justice more than say, Diplo or Girltalk or some super-hyped DJ is that they do actually make them music they are there to “perform.” They could actually practice a bit, have a live drummer on some songs, or play keyboards more and add some new elements or whatever, but they choose not to. So they’re not DJing (playing records of other peoples shit in a crafty way) and they’re not creating live music. (stop me if this is wrong, but that’s how it sounds…) So wtf are they doing?

I saw Lush play in the 90s and they did the same thing essentially, played the song with lots of programming and prerecorded vocals and basically bored the pants off me.

Using this as an opportunity to attack electronic music is lame, but so is trying to defend it by saying that’s what all electronic bands do. No, that’s not the case. Most electro bands are either totally DJs or put some other people on the stage and rock out a bit.

FWIW Justice’s record is hot as shit and will definitely be listened to by me and other dorks 10 years from now when we’re trying to relive that heady sexy summer of 2007. But my memories will be of other people spinning DANCE in a club…if I live that long.

i got a fat woody for your tight anuses.

The only problem I see here is that people want to call Justice DJs. They’re not DJs. They’re producers and they’re performers. How live they are only depends on what machinery you consider to be a live instrument. That giant gray area between turntables and laptops is all fair game and anyone fucking around with those tools is gonna get shit on and/or worshipped for it. I’m sick of turntablists crying foul over any kind of fucking technology. I’m also sick of these ignorant douchebags doing fade-in, fade-out A-B mixing with a tool as powerful as Ableton and calling themselves DJs. But all this shit comes with technological advancement. A tool is only as powerful as you are skilled to use it. And skills are only important to people with enough knowledge to care. So what matters more…the majority or the minority? And which group of people comprise the minority and the majority?

All I know is that I went to the Baltimore show and saw them in Philly 6 months ago. Both times I got drunk and I danced and I had fun. As long as I end up with my head in the toilet, a ringing in my ears, and bruises on my arms from fucking around on the dancefloor, then I’m happy. And yeah, I’m fucking happy.

The Justice record is awesome… it was worth seeing them once for a neat art installation and loud new takes to their tunes. The rest… who cares… I say take any frustration you may have and create something exciting with ableton and use weird controllers and prove to everyone that one can put on an exciting, kinetic, and dangerous electronic set. To me electronic music is still very young as far as the interfaces and creating it “live”… it’s honestly still a little awkward. I know it will get more interesting in the future with the new innovations in touch-screens and tons of music gear manufacturers spending their R&D money to create new interfaces and programs to inspire…

In my opinion Justice’s popularity is a good phenomenon in the US as I think the more bedroom electronica kids there are out there the better… the ones that stick with it will probably make something that will blow your mind in the future… so if anything the “Justice phenomenon” is adding something new to American teen/myspace/pop culture that yanks of a younger generation didn’t really “get” until now.

Meh. Life’s too short to get bent out of shape about whether they were twiddling knobs in real time. Unless someone was actually producing their shit for them the Milli Vanilli comparison isn’t apt. Don’t know that I’d see them again, but I’ve certainly had worse Wednesday evenings.

As for the crowd, nobody springs from the womb with a stack of impeccably-selected 12s in their hand. If anything it was interesting to see people who’re new to the genre wrapping their heads around it. Some of them will dig deeper, others won’t. Unless I’m stuck on a road trip with them their musical taste has very little impact on my life.

debockle is the new debacle!

Research before writing. “history shows that we invented the modern dance music movement with our legendary gay discos in the 1970s.” In regards to that comment, check out what other countries were doing before “we” were. Research The Radiophonic Workshop from the UK (circa 1950s) or Delia Derbyshire (circa 1905’s, 1960s, 1970s). I would believe that was prior to the “gay discos of the 1970s” and not to mention another country. America may have revolutionized the dance movement in the 1970s. But we did not invent it. And those were just two examples of people/groups who were creating electronic beats BEFORE the 1970s, that you are claiming to be the era “we” created the dance movement.

nice review though, consider you are a dj as well. I guess when you think of yourself well enough you can tear anyone who is more famous and doing better than you down eh?

I can’t win them all, but I am entitled to my own opinion and this review was for the DC show, not the baltimore affair.

I am picky and critical of dance music because I lhave an incredible passion for its history, culture and live experience. Don’t get it twisted, anyone who knows me or seen me out at other parties can often catch me dancing it up with everyone else and loving every minute, not cross-armed in the DJ booth making comments at every record being played. That being said, I’m sticking by my guns that Justice was simply a travesty.

To my own defense, DJing is alot more than just playing records, its a long curated process and a physical artform that I have worked on for 8 years since I was 17 and I continue to strive to improve. Unfortunately, that much needed maturity and learning process that DJs used to undergo is being slowly eliminated with the new technology. I am not opposed to technology, I probably will be playing off a computer by the end of the year. However, working at this the old fashioned way has made me pretty versatile I think I do a pretty good job. To each his own….